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Egon & Jenine
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Nicklert
Ghosthead
Joined: Mar 31, 2003
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 Posted: Jun 08, 2003 10:18 PM
Why didn't Egon & Jenine ever get together???
In the movies or the Cartoon?? 
There was an ovious love connection 
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Um...Ray We'd like to shoot the monster?
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E Graves
Ghosthead
Joined: Apr 21, 2003
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Posted: Jun 09, 2003 12:06 AM
Well, I suppose you could theorize all sorts of things, like Louis Tully hooking up with Janine instead (gag), or perhaps Janine just got tired of Egon failing to notice her, or a hundred other complications, blah blah blah blah, but the real reason Egon and Janine are not together is this:
The network executives and people involved in the Ghostbusters cartoon (with a few major exceptions *coughJMScough*) are LAME. Heaven forbid a character actually change and have development. The little kiddie's minds couldn't handle it. (/sarcasm)
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"Why do I say things like that? I always get in trouble..."
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Veedramon
Ghosthead
Joined: Feb 03, 2003
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Posted: Jun 09, 2003 9:31 AM
Graves, of course, puts it quite well.
Okay, first off, some of what I'm about to say (well, cut and paste, actually) previously appeared in some of the following topics. Refer to them for more on the matter...
The Many Faces of Janine
What About Janine?"
and
J. Micheal Straczynski interviewed by Proton Charging
RGB got stuck in a rut because it was a cartoon that became more and more aimed at kids after JMS quit as Story Editor. Some of the prevailing "wisdoms" in American cartoon writing thought are: "Romance is boring when you want to tell action toys to eight year old boys"(which is true, unfortunately, for the most part) and especially "The Status Quo Must Be Maintained" (More a judgement about the percieved short attention spans of kids and the crassly commercial urge to sell it into syndication--if the Status Quo never changes, it doesn't matter what order the episodes run in)
Then GB2 threw the whole Louis Tully monkey wrench into things. And the real reason for that was because none other than Harold Ramis found Egon and Janine's scenes in GB1 "failed" and "mawkish" (He goes into this on the commentary track of the GB1 DVD). Let me tell you, seeing those scenes in GB2 were just...wrong. And then to find out it was Ramis's idea...it's like finding out one of your best friends was cheated on by another one of your best friends, only to find out that the cheated on friend's own father set it up.
Or in the words of a Ghosthead known as "Doctor Stantz":
Janine Melnitz + Louis Tully = One fan with a nauseated stomach
To their credit, the RGB writers vetoed that--two episodes that ran after GB2 testify to that: "The Ghostbusters Live From Al Capone's Tomb" (Janine kisses Egon at the end, in full sight of Louis) and especially "Janine You've Changed", the latter of which actually held the promise that Egon and Janine were finally going to be allowed to happen.
Then XGB came out and restored the old same "unresolved" Status Quo from RGB as though "Janine You've Changed" never happened. Dammit, Egon and Janine weren't the stars of XGB anyway, so how much different would it have been if instead of popping up after not seeing him in years ("Darkness At Noon") she'd popped up to, say, bring him some paperwork he forgot and she rescued in time "before the Twins drew Venn diagrams all over them in crayon"? almost no difference at all. "The Crawler", "Temporary Insanity", and "Rage" would've needed rewrites, but that would've been all.
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--Dr. Fritz V. Baugh, Mad Scientist and Official Historian of Ghostbusters: West Coast Division
Also known as GBCentral's Doc Fritz
Visit The Digibusters Ectozone, home of the Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline!!!!! and the New Ghostbusters Timeline!. The Ectozone is a member of the GB Community Board
Also visit The Ghostbusters Fact List!
And read one of my Fan Fictions Pretty Please?
Egon and Janine Forever!!!
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sexy sadie
Ghosthead
Joined: Jul 16, 2001
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Posted: Jun 09, 2003 3:03 PM
She wasn't really that sexy! He was TOO...hot  !
The first lines of Bobby Brown's rap bit in ON OUR OWN-"too hot to handle"-describe Egon to a T!
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Love to all Ghostheads!
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EgonsBabe
Ghosthead
Joined: Jun 06, 2003
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Posted: Jun 09, 2003 10:05 PM
Hello Everyone!
Finally! A chance to actually create a debate on this issue. The answer is simple: Janine and Egon are not compatible. He would probably go for a girl would took an honest interest in what he does. Let's face it, Janine is not really a science-minded person, and also her character comes across to me as a little ditzy. Yeah maybe she did get tired of Egon not having mutual romantic feelings. That's probably why she went for Louis instead. Besides I thought they made an even cuter couple. Egon may have also trouble finding the right words to express that he wanted to keep his relationship with her at a platonic level, without hurting her deeply. I know I would if I was in his place.
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Peter:"It's the thing! The monster! It's here! Only it's different!
Egon:"Peter calm down! You're babbling!
Peter:"What word don't you understand Egon? Thing, monster or different?
Egon:"Well, you can start with your definition of monster. *ROAR!* That'll do.
Thanx for the signature pic Zack! And the Av! They rock!!!
Egon and Clara Hamilton(a character in my FF)4ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Please read my FanFic. More will come later.
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E Graves
Ghosthead
Joined: Apr 21, 2003
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Posted: Jun 09, 2003 10:25 PM
Hoo boy.
I supose I could let Dr. Veedramon lecture at length on that interpretation, but he's already done that. Quite a few times. So I'll just boil down his argument since he's not online; Egon has dropped several signs that he likes Janine. I believe "Janine, You've Changed" and "Ragnarok and Roll" would be the most obvious examples (I like to entertain the notion Egon is looking back at Janine with a certain reluctance to leave after he says "I think I better go" in "Citizen Ghost," but that one is probably just me).
I doubt Egon would push her away just because she wasn't intersted in science or whatever; after all, Egon did manage to become rather good friends with Peter Venkman...
I agree with Dr. Veedramon about how they shoulda been married in Extreme GB, it's not like they didn't have Kylie and Edwardo to mess around with. "The Crawler," however, has redeemed itself in my mind because I literally fell out of my chair laughing at Egon's "Give me some sugar, baby!" line.
-Graves
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"Why do I say things like that? I always get in trouble..."
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Veedramon
Ghosthead
Joined: Feb 03, 2003
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Posted: Jun 09, 2003 10:29 PM
Make no mistake about it, and I won't: there are some problems they would have to overcome.
But to explore some of your points:
Janine ditsy? In GB2 and later seasons of RGB maybe--at times she was downright stupid. But remember she "reads a lot"--there is something of an intellectual side hiding there. It's quite clear that Egon's brains is what drew her to him in the first place--she may not understand everything he says about quantum modulus and psychokinetic resonance, but she appreciates that he does
And of course you make one point that is clearly in error: that he only has platonic feelings for her. Look at "Ragnarok and Roll", where he's whispering her name when he thinks he's about to die. Look at "Robo Buster": if that isn't a display of flaming, unabashed jealousy, what is it? Or "The Halloween Door": Ray has horrified realization that Boogaloo is after the Containment Unit. Egon follows up with horrified realization that Janine is at Ground Zero for the above. And of course this discussion wouldn't be complete without "Janine You've Changed", where he tells her straight out he loves her.
He grew up in a restrictive environment (he had no toys, (GB2)) and if his father is anything like Uncle Cyrus he didn't get much fatherly nurturing, either. He was pressured to an oppressive degree to be an academic: he got his first college degree when his contemporaries were still in grade school. ("Rollerghoster"). The cost was his social development--emotion, especially the toxic soup we call "love" scares the living hell out of him. He loves her. He just has trouble saying so.
That's a big problem, no doubt. But not an insurmountable one.
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--Dr. Fritz V. Baugh, Mad Scientist and Official Historian of Ghostbusters: West Coast Division
Also known as GBCentral's Doc Fritz
Visit The Digibusters Ectozone, home of the Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline!!!!! and the New Ghostbusters Timeline!. The Ectozone is a member of the GB Community Board
Also visit The Ghostbusters Fact List!
And read one of my Fan Fictions Pretty Please?
Egon and Janine Forever!!!
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EgonsBabe
Ghosthead
Joined: Jun 06, 2003
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Posted: Jun 09, 2003 11:52 PM
Okay let me explain my opinion to this issue a little further. I think that as the cartoon series progressed, one thing you have to keep in mind is that with any show, there will be mistakes with continuity. I was in a film & TV course for the last two years of when I was in high school, so I know that these kinds of mistakes happen. Plus I also pay very close attention to even the smallest details whenever I watch shows. And another thing, when I mentioned that Egon would rather go for a girl who took an honest interest in what he does, I based in on the fact that I personally never really heard Janine ask him to tell her more about what he does. And listen to her tones of voice. She doesn't sound like she's making a real effort in taking an honest interest. I hope I've been clearer on that. If I really wanted to know more about a person I liked, that's what I'd do. Another thing I want to see is what Janine would do for Egon's Birthday. But that was never covered in the cartoon series.
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Peter:"It's the thing! The monster! It's here! Only it's different!
Egon:"Peter calm down! You're babbling!
Peter:"What word don't you understand Egon? Thing, monster or different?
Egon:"Well, you can start with your definition of monster. *ROAR!* That'll do.
Thanx for the signature pic Zack! And the Av! They rock!!!
Egon and Clara Hamilton(a character in my FF)4ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Please read my FanFic. More will come later.
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Veedramon
Ghosthead
Joined: Feb 03, 2003
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Posted: Jun 09, 2003 11:58 PM
Good points. But let me address the birthday point in specific:
You're right that no RGB episode had anything to do with Egon's birthday. But an Extreme Ghostbusters episode, "Back In The Saddle" (a two-parter) showed her going to a great length to give him a great birthday present: she surprised him with a reunion of the original Ghostbusters, who had scattered all over the country by that point. That HAD to have taken some work to arrange...
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--Dr. Fritz V. Baugh, Mad Scientist and Official Historian of Ghostbusters: West Coast Division
Also known as GBCentral's Doc Fritz
Visit The Digibusters Ectozone, home of the Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline!!!!! and the New Ghostbusters Timeline!. The Ectozone is a member of the GB Community Board
Also visit The Ghostbusters Fact List!
And read one of my Fan Fictions Pretty Please?
Egon and Janine Forever!!!
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EgonsBabe
Ghosthead
Joined: Jun 06, 2003
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Posted: Jun 10, 2003 12:34 AM
I didn't see EGB so I didn't know about that. Continuing from where I left of on the issue of continuity, when there are personnel changes at the studio, it's also hard to remember everything that you need to tell the new employees, in order to keep the continuity flowing correctly. These points that I make are all from an objective point of view. Now here's my opinion of Janine as a fan of GB: She is not exactly on my favourite list of GB characters.
"Tough going Janine old girl. But don't worry, as soon as we can, we'll get you to a vet"-Peter Venkman.
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Peter:"It's the thing! The monster! It's here! Only it's different!
Egon:"Peter calm down! You're babbling!
Peter:"What word don't you understand Egon? Thing, monster or different?
Egon:"Well, you can start with your definition of monster. *ROAR!* That'll do.
Thanx for the signature pic Zack! And the Av! They rock!!!
Egon and Clara Hamilton(a character in my FF)4ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Please read my FanFic. More will come later.
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Veedramon
Ghosthead
Joined: Feb 03, 2003
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Posted: Jun 10, 2003 10:05 AM
And I'm quite fond of her. That might be part of why we disagree on whether she's a good match for Egon , a character we both obviously consider a favorite (your user name, my avatar  )
I forgot to say this before (I was kind of pressed for time last night--I was actually using the computer at work  ) but thank you for opening the debate. As Graves indicates, this is a subject of great interest to me.
But maybe then, to continue, let me accept your two points on Janine as true: she's not really interested in Egon's job, which leads down a road that says she's not really interested in his mind, which is a major part of his personality (as I say above, one that was overdeveloped, stifling his emotions), and that...that...(sorry, this is tough for me to say even hypothetically) that Louis Tully was a better match for her. So my question is this: why in the hell does she keep going back to Egon?
Think about it. He'd been gently brushing her off for the better part of ten years by XGB (I actually think by XGB they'd known each other for fourteen years, but that's a different topic). She dumped Louis Tully to continue to chase Egon (aforementioned "Al Capone's Tomb" makes this clear), despite the fact that Louis was clearly, y'know, willing? And after not apparently seeing him for years at the start of XGB, she shows up out of the blue to see him again.
So is she just simply that gooned on his pheromones? Is it part of her self-esteem issues ("Janine You've Changed"), meaning "any guy who'd demonstrate liking for me is probably some kind of loser"? Is she just that stubborn, bordering on obsessed?
You're far more qualified to speak on the female mind than am, EgonsBabe. (Even considering it's a fictional one crafted by predominantly male writers). I await your insights.
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--Dr. Fritz V. Baugh, Mad Scientist and Official Historian of Ghostbusters: West Coast Division
Also known as GBCentral's Doc Fritz
Visit The Digibusters Ectozone, home of the Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline!!!!! and the New Ghostbusters Timeline!. The Ectozone is a member of the GB Community Board
Also visit The Ghostbusters Fact List!
And read one of my Fan Fictions Pretty Please?
Egon and Janine Forever!!!
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JohnnySparks
Ghosthead
Joined: Jul 02, 2002
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Posted: Jun 10, 2003 10:11 AM
Because her character turned into a complete flake in Gb2 and in the cartoon.(only the original Janine had the flare to hold egon's attention)
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Just because you are dead doesn't mean I am finished with you.....
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ProtonDefender
Ghosthead
Joined: Feb 10, 2002
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Posted: Jun 10, 2003 1:58 PM
There is the simple fact that people change, and like in real life we all tend to like people off and on; sometimes the feelings never go away, sometimes they do, plain and simple.
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EgonsBabe
Ghosthead
Joined: Jun 06, 2003
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Posted: Jun 10, 2003 7:43 PM
Hi Everyone!
I hope my comments haven't offended any Janine fans out there. Veedramon you have brought up some interesting questions as to why Janine keeps chasing after Egon. She maybe just enjoys the thrill of the chase(He's playing 'hard to get'). But there has to be a point where she has to realize "hey this is going nowhere" and accept the fact that Egon may not be ready to enter into that kind of relationship. As I also mentioned earlier, he obviously has had a lot of trouble finding the right way to let her down gently. I know I would! He probably also said that he loved her in that episode just to appease her, which was not exactly a good thing to do on his part because it would lead her on. Egon may not also have known that that's what would happen. If I also understand you correctly, it sounds like Janine finally reached the end of her chasing Egon and went back out with Louis again, right? As I said before, I thought they made an adorable couple. Oh and one other thing I want to mention, remember on the episode "Janine's Genie" Egon laughed at her, asking why she would "want such an eyesore". That comment pissed her off.
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Peter:"It's the thing! The monster! It's here! Only it's different!
Egon:"Peter calm down! You're babbling!
Peter:"What word don't you understand Egon? Thing, monster or different?
Egon:"Well, you can start with your definition of monster. *ROAR!* That'll do.
Thanx for the signature pic Zack! And the Av! They rock!!!
Egon and Clara Hamilton(a character in my FF)4ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Please read my FanFic. More will come later.
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roshangar
Ghosthead
Joined: Jan 16, 2003
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Posted: Jun 10, 2003 7:48 PM
Isn't this an old topic?
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Ghostbusters Convention:I love this plan! I'm excited to be a part of it! Let's do it!
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Janine, didn't yo momma eva tell you not ta get involved with no Ghostbusta!
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Veedramon
Ghosthead
Joined: Feb 03, 2003
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Posted: Jun 10, 2003 8:50 PM
Yeah, it probably is
I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this, EgonsBabe. You say "Egon just can't figure out how to let her down gently", I say "He has trouble telling her he really loves her."
But as far as Louis goes, he does not appear in XGB. Thusly, there is no canonical evidence to support the idea that she picks things back up with Louis or whatever, only speculations. Similarly, there is no canonical evidence things ever work out with her and Egon. I'm just a romantic and an optimist, so I like to think they do.
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--Dr. Fritz V. Baugh, Mad Scientist and Official Historian of Ghostbusters: West Coast Division
Also known as GBCentral's Doc Fritz
Visit The Digibusters Ectozone, home of the Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline!!!!! and the New Ghostbusters Timeline!. The Ectozone is a member of the GB Community Board
Also visit The Ghostbusters Fact List!
And read one of my Fan Fictions Pretty Please?
Egon and Janine Forever!!!
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